Any chemists out there?

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Anblick
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Any chemists out there?

Postby Anblick » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:20 pm

I recently got this idea in my head where the killer adds sulfuric acid to a victim's beverage to kill/mame them.

Obvious questions are:

1) Which beverages would create an instant obvious reaction?

2) Which ones would neutralize it?

3) Which would enhance it?

4) Would it work at all?
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Postby pengwenn » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:33 pm

I'm no chemist but I think alkali based compounds would neutralize acid compounds. Milk might be alkali based but I can't remember. Not much help am I? :?
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Postby Anblick » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:54 pm

Yeah, I'm thinking more of a bar scene type, so I want to know more of how it would work out there, as I have no idea if alcoholoc drinks are acidic or alkaline and/or will cause a visible chemical reaction...
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Postby charlesp » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:55 pm

I know there is some sulfuric acid in toilet bowl cleaners... some anyway... was a janitor in the boys dorm in school... had some splash in my eye once... scared me to death.. burned like hell.. but didn't do any permanent damage.

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Postby Anblick » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:57 pm

OK, 5th question to add to the list for the chemistry knowledeable then:

5) Is there a more potent and easily to obtain/create acid that could be used?
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Postby pengwenn » Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:57 pm

So I guess charles is suggesting that Anblick take some toilet bowl cleaner to a bar and order a bunch of drinks and pour some in. I'd like to see the look on that bar tender's face. :lol:
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Postby Anblick » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:01 pm

Where's that headshake smilie when you need it?
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Postby charlesp » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:05 pm

I think the other problem would be that sulfuric acid (if I recall correctly) isn't THAT much more potent than stomach acid... and hence would be hard to have it do a LOT of damage if digested (as it would be hard to get enough in them to do the damage)...

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Postby Anblick » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:09 pm

But from my understanding, it would do enough damage on contact to at least mame the victim for a long period of time on feeder tubes, etc.

Heck, serial killers use it to dissolve tissue/bones...
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Postby pengwenn » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:22 pm

If it works so fast wouldn't it just destroy the tongue and mouth?
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Postby Anblick » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:24 pm

These thoughts are why I'm posting in the research section! Hopefully one of our chemist or serial killer posters here can help me out!
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Postby pengwenn » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:33 pm

As long as you don't ask for volunteers to help you out with some experiments. :shock:
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Postby charlesp » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:36 pm

Well I'm pretty sure to have it at a strength to do that damage it's also noxious enough that it would be pretty danged hard to hide it in a drink (IE you'd need a high enough percentage if acid to "drink" that it would be very hard to pull off the "switch" without it being noticed that you're putting in a bunch of acid AND person would have to already be REAL drunk to not notice it)... BUT I'm NOT a chemist... IT seems more likely that swapping out a shot of something (that might be downed real fast) could possibly work better than hiding acid in a drink like you would with a "mickey".

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Postby Anblick » Mon Oct 10, 2005 8:53 pm

Kind of what I was thinking, but the color needs the right consistency.
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Postby hyperfine » Thu Oct 13, 2005 11:46 am

Okay, here's some chemical thoughts:

The only alkaline drink that occurs to me right now is milk - juices/water/pop are acidic or neutral. Incidentally, whenever you neutralize an acid you usually get bubbles forming - less obivous in a fizzy drink.

In terms of damage, I imagine you could get some pretty impressive chemical burns on the way down, but that would be pretty painful (ie you wouldn't take another sip) so I like the shot idea - I mean a shot of vodka or something kind of burns on the way down. Also once you get mouth/throat damage it becomes difficult to swallow so it would probably take some doing to actually kill someone via acid (not saying it can't be done - I've never tried :wink: )

I think any strong acid (one that completlley dissociates in water) would work equally well - sulfuric acid, nitric acid, hydrochloric acid, hydrobromic acid...there are some others.) You would have to have it at quite a high concentration though (I've spilled dilute acid on my bare hands on more than one occasion and it just stings a bit)

I'm not sure what alcohol (ethanol) and an acid do, but I have a sneaking suspicion it's something. I'll have to think about that.
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Postby Anblick » Thu Oct 13, 2005 5:11 pm

Thanks. The more I think of this story, the less I actually want the victims to die, but rather suffer...
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Postby pengwenn » Thu Oct 13, 2005 6:03 pm

If there's enough damage to the throat there might be a possibility that it will swell and restrict breathing. I don't know if it is enough to suffocate someone but it might work as a great torture device. :twisted:
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Postby Anblick » Thu Oct 13, 2005 6:05 pm

Well, I'm thinking for my story that the bad guy is seeking revenge and targeting the victim multiple times over in public scenes in ways that are torturous! :twisted:
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Postby hyperfine » Sat Oct 15, 2005 11:59 am

Sounds cool. Good luck with that.
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