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A place for you writers to complain about your writing and the writing process... maybe posting what you got done today to make you feel like less of a writing failure.

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Postby TheMudge » Mon Aug 18, 2008 12:16 pm

I really like that one, Mlou.
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Postby musthavebeenmykarma » Mon Aug 18, 2008 7:02 pm

Love the story about the tomatoes. I'm growing my own for the first time this year. Ah, the mistakes I've made.... who knew you could over-nourish them?

Great article, Mlou, congrats.
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Postby Mlou » Tue Sep 02, 2008 2:53 pm

CSMonitor just accepted another essay. Don't know when it will be in yet. I'm just happy the editor likes them. Must be all of 30 years since I sold them a poem for the first time. Yikes! I don't like the sound of that. :shock:
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Postby Mlou » Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:18 am

Hey, Karma...Actually Mae is still producing tomatoes. Should I bring her in again this fall?? :-D
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Postby Hissmonster » Sun Sep 07, 2008 4:58 pm

You are really rocking Mlou!

Way to go.
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Postby Mlou » Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:37 pm

I was just noodling around in searches and came up with this:

http://www.highbeam.com/Search.xaspx?q=Mary+Lou+Healy

They have loads of my published stuff from the CSMonitor on there and you have to pay/belong to read it. So they're charging to read my stuff. How can they do that?
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Postby Hissmonster » Fri Sep 12, 2008 8:17 pm

tried this twice and it won't let me access it...question is who is Highbeam?

Are they an affiliate or associate of some sort of the CSM?

When CSM buys your stuff, do they buy subsequent rights, meaning that they have the right to farm it out to affiliates who can charge for it, but the author doesn't get paid extra for this?

Some mags such as confessionals, but total rights,which means that they not only can resell stories without paying the authors residuals, they can edit them as the see fit. You go into those deals knowing that you gave up the rights to something for usually a higher monetary compensation.....many authors use penn names for these type of mags because of it.

As for Highbeam and CSM, I'm not sure what they've worked out or if it's an infringement deal as I can't seem to access it...

Can anyone else get more info on this and thier relationship?
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Postby Hissmonster » Fri Sep 12, 2008 8:22 pm

Ok hang on...went through a back door....and it seems that they are not charging for the article per se, but for their research and collection. This is a research library, pulling all archived pieces that were published....what this means is you join the service and they have done the work for you so you don't have to go to the archives of several sites and pay for back issues or go to your local library and spend ions of time researching their archives.

That is unfortunately a legit loophool as they are not rebroadcasting/publishing anything they are just making once public information accessible to you for a fee.
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Postby Mlou » Sat Sep 13, 2008 8:17 am

CSMonitor buys one time rights for a period of (I think) 6 months. Copyright then reverts to author, for resale or whatever.
However, I think it stinks that another place can use it among their "for charge" information without any royalty or permission from the author. They have all my poems and essays for the CSM on there, quite a bunch of material.

I found another place with one of my short stories for children on it but I feel that's legit because it's the website of the magazine that bought it. They are using it as a teaching tool.
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Postby xcheck24 » Sat Sep 13, 2008 9:13 am

How did they get the stuff? And if the rights revert back to you, I think you can raise a stink.
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Postby JillStar » Sat Sep 13, 2008 9:57 am

We've posted parts of poems from other authors here and, in some cases, the whole poem. Usually we're doing it to learn from the author's work and we also state who the author is. Plus... there isn't a lot of profit going on here.

It's a fine line I suppose. I post pictures and don't always state where I get them but try to remember. I also post parts of articles, but I include a link to the original source.

I'm not sure how to handle a research library. I know from the stand point of someone who researches, it sounds like a great idea because articles disappear after a while and it would be nice to find them again. But from the point of view of a writer, it would feel like a violation if someone just came along and decided to post up my work without asking me, let alone paying me. I feel differently about articles VS poetry and stories. I feel poems and stories need the authors to be paid or at least asked.
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Postby Hissmonster » Sat Sep 13, 2008 10:59 am

I say you should inquire, but you will probably get the part that this is a collection of public information and what we charge for is the time it takes us to collect it....but it couldn't hurt.

They get it the same way we all do...they earmark the publications and then have a system of downloading all new published material. (like a library buy newpapers and magazines).


it's a legit business, just like if you are doing research on a company online, there are several fee for service companies who charge you for a copy of the Dunn and Bradstreet reports and profile, which you can get a the local library for free. Dunn and Bradstreet are not making $$ on this. What they charge for is their time in collecting the data on x # of companies and providing it to you w/ little effort on your part.

And yes we do post other's work and piece from other sites, but again, we don't charge for it and we try to provide credit where credit is due.

Mlou....they give you credit. Do they offer information on where to find your work....ie. some place where you will make $? Say Amazon.com?
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Postby Mlou » Sat Sep 13, 2008 11:51 am

Jill, it's one thing to post a portion of something, giving credit to source, as we do here for teaching purposes. It's another to have the whole thing used there without a by your leave.
Hiss, no they don't give any further info on me. You can search my name there and they offer up all this stuff, giving due credit to the Monitor and my byline is on the material. But it seems kind of unfair because my material is posted there forever, presumably. How am I ever going to be able to use it for re-sale, etc. if it's on there in perpetuity?
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Postby xcheck24 » Sat Sep 13, 2008 11:59 am

Did the monitor sell it to them? Have a partnership with them? Is this included in any contract that you have with the monitor?

I certainly would ask about it, at least to the monitor. They might not even know about it and may also be upset about it.
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Postby Hissmonster » Sat Sep 13, 2008 12:01 pm

That's the rub and I'm not sure. Can you read/access it without payment?

I think it falls under the same tennents as a Pre-published piece.....I mean if I really wanted to I can go and pull an article from the Boston Globe printed the year I was born from the BPL (assuming they go back to ancient times), as it is in their collection of printed material.

I don't have to pay the author or the paper for it.

But, I would have to pay whomever owns the rights if I republished it for syndication or for profit in any commercial venue.

The question then becomes....well, how do we know that we aren't being plagarized or bilked by someone who can access this info and then use to their discretion?

With the ease of accessing material on the net these days instead of physically going to places like research libraries, this question is only going to get more pronounced.

But, I would check to see if they are re-selling the articles or just charging for accesses to the material....w/ the former you have the right to ask them to remove them etc. With the latter, I'm not so sure.
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Postby Mlou » Sat Sep 13, 2008 12:04 pm

My contract says 90 days and then it's mine, with "all book rights"and all rights except....aha.... it retains non-exclusive rights for Monitor and retrospectives of same. BUT it also retains electronic distribution for "Monitor archive licensees" so that's probably where the catch is. If this site is a "licensee" then that's it.
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Postby Hissmonster » Sat Sep 13, 2008 4:02 pm

That's it...that is so the monitor does not have to pull a story from its archives after the time limit is up.

And highbeam is probably a licensee....
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Postby musthavebeenmykarma » Sun Sep 14, 2008 11:11 am

Hmm... the first "archiving" explanation sounds fishy to me... but if it's in your contract that they can give it to retrospectives, I'd ask CSM if Highbeam is a retrospective, if not you should definately raise a stink :wink:
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Postby PaulG » Sun Sep 14, 2008 3:08 pm

I am not a legal expert, nor do I play one on TV.

Looking around on the Highbeam.com site, when you read about who they are and what they do, it would appear that are an on-line archive/library. They charge people a subscription fee to have access to all the files on their "shelves". Whether you go in there for 1 article or 1,000 the fee does not change. Ergo, the author is in the same boat as if one were to wander in to the local library and find this past issue of CSM on the back of some shelf with Mlou's article 10 years from now. Mlou would not be compensated in that scenario either.

That's my take for what it's worth.
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Postby Mlou » Sun Sep 14, 2008 3:14 pm

That's more or less what we figured, Paul. And if the CSMonitor has licensed it then I have no complaint. They pay top dollar for your work to begin with. I have found small "nobody" sites, though, where my work turns up and I KNOW they are not licensed with anybody. The oddest places you can imagine. Now what does that say about my material?? :-D
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Postby Hissmonster » Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:55 pm

LOL...that the odd and obsure love you too, mlou!

:-P :D
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Postby xcheck24 » Sun Sep 14, 2008 9:34 pm

PaulG wrote:Ergo, the author is in the same boat as if one were to wander in to the local library and find this past issue of CSM on the back of some shelf with Mlou's article 10 years from now. Mlou would not be compensated in that scenario either.


But they don't charge you to look at old CSM articles in the local library. A little different.
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Postby Hissmonster » Sun Sep 14, 2008 9:36 pm

no but they do charge you if you want to make a copy. I find that online sites have a tendency to charge upfront rather than letting you view their database and then hope you will print a copy or request one......
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Postby Mlou » Mon Sep 29, 2008 5:23 pm

I just want to acknowledge publicly the honesty of BJBourg. Although his mag. is now defunct and it took him a while...I had a poem in Mouth Full of Bullets back in April, I think...and I received my check last week. Thank you, BJ! I only wish his publication had been able to survive the trials and tribulations undergone by so many small pubs. today. But, as timber posted elsewhere, BJ found it difficult to give family and other things the proper priority, as the mag ate up so much of his time.
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Postby JillStar » Mon Sep 29, 2008 6:01 pm

Family is definitely first!!
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